r/learnfrench • u/kcon123 • 2d ago
Question Is it common for native English speakers to pronounce /u/ incorrectly in certain words?
For example pronouncing "pour" like "port" or "l'amour" like "la mort"?
•
u/MahautganyBandit 2d ago edited 2d ago
Its a distinctive mark of native English speakers.
Edit : and it sounds cool and sophisticated.
•
u/Firm-Yam3175 3h ago
yeah! I hate the o and ou ! It's so difficult as a native English speaker. Dessous/dessus, etc. I try to over say it in the hopes that at least it's clear if I'm attempting cou vs cul. Mostly, I don't have much trouble with comprehension, but when I know the word it could sound like, it's somewhat embarrassing.
But I also LOVE accents. So, while I try to make sure I'm understood, I have no desire to remove my English accent. Its who I am. Other example, I absolutely adore when French speakers say Z instead of th in sounds. Truthfully, I find those super easy to differentiate, but I know I've had years of practice in my native language and francophones would say the same with my hiccups. Is what it is. Speaking another language is hard and I have so much patience and respect for people who do it!
•
u/PoxonAllHoaxes 2d ago
Yes because that reflects English phonology, which however is not uniform, plus confusion even for those who have the sounds about the spelling. So very many English speakers pronounce poor the same as ENGLISH pour, so we can write this as POHR, and they may not have in their dialect any such thing as the OO vowel before R.
•
u/Actual_Cat4779 2d ago
Yes. In my variety of English, not only is there no such thing as OO before R, there's also no such thing as R at the end of a word.
Usually, French people are pretty good at understanding British accents, but I did have a problem once because I was asking someone where "la gare" was and it just didn't make sense to him without the R. I think eventually I asked about the "station ferroviaire". Or maybe I just said "les trains". We got there eventually.
So now I try to produce that French R sound and to add it to the ends of words when possible.
•
•
u/passionfruit62022 2d ago
Yes. It took me a lot of practising to be able to get the hang of ou vs u sounds.
•
u/_matthewa 2d ago
a lot of native english people also struggle with cou and cul
you could say they don’t know their arse from their neck
•
u/wun-sen 2d ago
How are they supposed to be pronounced?
•
u/Far-Ad-4340 2d ago edited 2d ago
/u is supposed to be very close (or "high"), that is to say, the tongue should be right below the palate, with as little distance as possible. It is the same as an /o (monophtong, not the English diphtong o), but closer. That height/closeness is the same as in /i and /y, but the part of the tongue that rises is further back.
In English, depending on the accent, you might have a similar sound, but you often actually use /ʊ, which is more central and open. That's important because it reduces the contrast with the vowel /y (spelled "u" in French).
•
u/Actual_Cat4779 2d ago
Transcriptions of pronunciations found in dictionaries are often misleading in that respect, as they represent both the English oo and French ou with the same /u/ symbol, which is inaccurate for many English speakers, as you say.
•
u/nomarmite 2d ago
British English, yes. In American English it can be almost a 'purr' or 'poyr' sound - it's one of the most obvious ways to work out where someone's from.
•
u/Intelligent_Donut605 2d ago
As a native speaker i can confirm it’s one of the most common givaways someone is anglophone
•
•
u/jahanzaibbaloch 1d ago
i know 4 languages but i never pronounced /u/ sound in any of languages i know still i could do pretty good
•
•
•
u/Unique_Anywhere5735 1d ago
Unfortunately, many native English speakers have a hard time pronouncing words in English...
•
u/ensoniq2k 1d ago
I took Paul Nobles audio course on French and while 99% is spoken by a native, the few occasions where he speaks french himself it sounds pretty horrible. So I'd say yes, it's pretty hard for native English speakers to pronounce certain words.
•
u/Careless_Category956 17h ago
I believe this shouldn’t be difficult. Words like book, rook, look have this sound. /y/ meanwhile 😭
•
u/Mrs_Ben_Wyatt24 2d ago
I’m an English person who speaks French pretty well and I’d say this is one of the things that I find most challenging and probably makes it most clear that I’m not a native speaker. The struggle is real