They're from a Kpop company, they trained in the Kpop system, their producers are Kpop producers, their style is recognizably (without any fancy definitions) Kpop. It simply looks like Kpop and sounds like Kpop. If I were to analyze it bc apperantly if I don't then I'm a huge idiot, then their dance is stronger than Jpop, but also more nuanced and detailed than American hip hop. But it does look just like Kpop. I'll summarize it as that.
Just like Jazz started as African American music and it will forever stay rooted there, even if it's composed and performed all over the world, Kpop started in Korea and it will always stay that way. Just because the name has K in it doesn't mean ridiculous stuff like that if someone who isn't Korean performs it then it's not Kpop anymore. Imagine the outrage if that was said about a music style that originated in Africa? And why? As if there isn't horrid racism against Koreans? Like why does everyone feel so comfortable arguing that it's not Kpop as if that doesn't answer the exact definition of cultural appropriation? I'm really so confused. People went into details like if it's not the most normal Kpop company ever then it's a global group and not Kpop. They didn't even say oh they're Kpop inspired or anything like straight up no they're not Kpop. I don't get it and it actually angers me. Kpop has a lot of variety in it but its features are also very recognizable. Why are people lashing out at anyone who dares say that Kpop inspired acts are Kpop? Why every post about Katseye in a Kpop subreddit has a bunch of "they're not Kpop" like ok yeah they just have the same fanbases I guess we will talk about them in the subreddits with Ari and Lady Gaga fans like what?! It was so rude imo and if you do think about it more deeply it's not only nonsensical but it's also disrespectful to all of the pioneers of Kpop
Even when groups start just debuting with no relation to Kpop whatsoever but doing Kpop style, I think it's totally fine to say that they're Kpop, Kpop inspired, or a fusion of Kpop and another genre. Just like we use other genres names to describe acts that are alike to it
Babe I do that too. It's all anime inspired except made by American people. It should at least be called anime inspired
Why are styles that originate in the west or in Africa mega protected but styles that originate in East Asia can be run over freely without being given credit?
i donât get why people even argue about this. like don't u guys have anything better to do? this is way too shallow to even call an argument. some of you act like you know better than the group itself
Honestly I don't think most people care what Katseye considers themselves to be.
What annoys ppl is the FANS switching up whenever it makes the group look good, or to make actual kpop groups look bad.
When they achieve something it's "katseye is the first 5th gen kpop girl group to _____" and in the next breath it's "Katseye has freedom & autonomy unlike manufactured kpop groups" or "thank god Yoonchae escaped kpop".
If y'all wanna discuss Katseye in kpop communities then whatever but stop using them to take punches at the real kpop groups/industry & you'll see how quickly people will stop caring about this.
exactly, you worded it so well. certain fans (not everyone ofc) will brag about certain achievements pertaining to kpop and katseye, but then proceed to demean the rest of the industry/other artists/the genre when it suits them.
when (again certain) fans constantly rip on kpop/act like itâs inferior, itâs frustrating that they insist on engaging in the kpop spaces when they will look down at the industry. if people view them as above kpop, they should move on to pop or music spaces rather than staying in kpop ones. i donât mind when people bring them up in kpop spaces as long as they clearly want to actually engage normally instead of pretending like katseye is above the genre that youâre currently in a space for.
I care because everywhere I go there are a bunch of angry comments like Katseye is not Kpop!
I think it is Kpop. Why are they always getting angry with me when I'm just minding my business? And if you think about it more deeply it's actually quite offensive to say that Katseye isn't Kpop
No, I thought about it and I think it's offensive. I explained why in another comment in this thread
I also think your other response only comes from disrespectful people. How can you say that to someone directly? Really, I shouldn't care what you think when you're that rude
Not to be mean, but you sound like you're 10 so I sure as hell hope you're not an adult. What you shouldn't care about is what anyone says about KatsEye because it should have zero impact on your feelings.
What are yall so unnecessarily mean for? Genuinely that's so crazy to me. Your life must be so much tougher than mine if you think it's fine to talk to people like that. I see the downvotes coming and I don't care, I know yall are the same as that person lol
I didn't mean that it offends me personally, I meant that it's offensive to Korea and to Kpop pioneers
Because their fan base is both kpop fans and kpop haters. The discussion is actually "they're not kpop because kpop is cringe" vs "IDC I love kpop so it's fine if they are partially"
Yall still having this debate? If XG isnât K-popâŚ. These girls are not K-pop, they arenât all Korean, nor do they sing in only Korean/ Koreanglish they literally were trained with K-pop methodology and now just make pop music and dance to it. Halfway under a Korean company but also an American company itâs really not that hard and shouldnât be such a point of contention bc at the end of the day it does not matter.
Any of these groups youâre mentioning⌠most of their songs are in Korean or koreanglishâŚ. despite an occasional English release. This feels like weaponized incompetence bc DUH yoonchae is Korean âthey arent Koreanâ clearly means they arenât ALL/ all SPEAK Korean. And once again duh there are non Koreans in K-pop groups but what is then their most used language in songs and out side of performances in their daily life as an idol THEY SPEAK KOREAN AND PROBABLY LIVE IN KOREA⌠đ¤Ł
Nope. Their english only songs are considered Kpop. Groups do fully English songs with no Korean version often. 90% english songs are becoming the norm also.
âthey arent Koreanâ clearly means they arenât ALL/ all SPEAK Korean.
So you're changing what you said. That's not required.
They identify as Kpop, did the Kpop contest and won, and have a Kpop company. They are on Kpop charts. Even have Kpop lightsticks, hell, even start their name with a K. They are Kpop. Global Kpop with sprinkles, as the Leader said. Accept it.
Groups do fully English songs maybe once every other mini album they arenât frequent at all⌠name 3 90% English songs made by K-pop groups rn, if you even can do that i bet you these songs are made by groups who are majority Korean, live in korea, and speak what? Korean. And if weâre going by your standards youâre changing what you said as wellâŚ. What is global K-pop? It was they are either a K-pop or a global group now youâre saying they are global K-pop? Thatâs not even a thing youâre just making stuff up to suit your narrative now. What does the âkâ in K-pop stand for? KOREAN⌠KOREAN POP they are a group made up of girls from across the world and they sing in more languages than just English and Korean so there for, global girl group. Like I asked before, which you seemed to ignore, if XG isnât considered K-pop but globalâŚ. Why would Katseye be K-pop and not global?
No they do them as their main song and mainly. In fact 100% Korean language Kpop or even mostly Korean is becoming more rare these days. There are articles and discussion about it.
heck, Kpop Demon Hunters only had English songs if you wanna go there lmao. Korean dub was the only language dub of that movie where they didn't dub the songs and left them english. And their songs were on the Kpop charts along with Katseye's this year btw
What is global K-pop?Â
Exactly what Sofia said. They are both and never letting go of being Kpop. Weird it upsets you :(
Well youâve proved my point. That was 2 songs from the same group off the same mini album. K-pop demon hunters is a movie and huntrix isnât a real group. You still havenât answered my question about XG. It doesnât upset me at all actually bc they just simply arenât a K-pop group Iâm just stating facts and trying to see if you have any facts to support your claimsâŚ. This is honestly your regular Reddit convo. If weâre going by your logic though even if *Sophia said they are both⌠Manon on multiple occasions has said they arenât K-pop they are global with K-pop methods. Plus youâre kind of twisting Sophiaâs words as she said âheavily inspired byâ âsprinklesâ youâre taking that and saying âSEE SHE SAID THEYâRE K-POP SHE SAID BOTHâ when thatâs not what she said 𤣠never letting go of that side is referring to their training and their branding which is like she said and I quote âheavily inspired by K-popâ anyways enjoy the rest of your day stream KATSEYE RISING GLOBAL POP SENSATION
No I proved mine. And KPDH is sung by real humans. The real songs were on the KPop charts listed by the artists who sung them. I don't follow XG so seems irrelevant. Maybe they're both too. I don't have a problem with that. People can be two things.
They simply are one. They identify as one and have the label. It's okay. Sofia said this after Manon, debunking her. Sofia is the team leader so what she says goes. She said it is both. Meaning both Kpop and Global. They will never let go of it. NEVERRRRRRR
And if we're being honest, sprinkles are a minor part of a dessert, so her saying that speaks volumes to the quantity of influence if we want to go there.
Yea judging by your last response youâre probably a child so maybe leave Reddit be for a while sweetie⌠you didnât disprove a thing as youâve come with no facts just vibes. Just because YOU donât follow XG doesnât make them irrelevant to the topic at hand but I digress⌠*Sophia is the leader so what she says goes? đ¤Łđ¤Ł no longer have anything more to say on the matter bc once again childish youâre also still not listening to what Sophia is saying she literally media trained her way thru saying âweâre not K-popâ and you keep proving my point and I love that for us
You're literally disagreeing with the leader of the group because... reasons?
Yes what she says goes. She said they are kpop and they are both. That they will never choose only one. They have everything that's required to become one. Re-evaluate what it takes.Â
Sofia proved it point and I love that for us (actual real KATSEYE fans)
And it's not just identity, it's their literal official record label. Both.
I mean no disrespect, but I find it quite interesting that suddenly it's "we are both Kpop and Global" but at the very start they (and their fans, especially their fans) seemed quite adamant on making that distinction that they are a global group and not Kpop (despite Kpop being a clear influence and an integral part of their creation), so why suddenly are they now wanting to attach themselves to the Kpop label? I honestly do not have a problem with them wanting to attach themselves to the Kpop label, and if anything they fall under the same category as groups like XG, Girlset, and even &TEAM. It's just the sudden switch up that has me a bit confused.
I donât think the group itself or hybe were ever saying that they werenât k-pop at ALL, they were pretty quick to coin the term âk-pop adjacentâ in interviews and publications. But youâre right in that the FANBASE was really adamant on either one side or the other; you might be conflating them. If they were trying to reject the k-pop association on a structural level, they wouldnât have started off appearing in Korean music shows right away and openly basing their concept on being trained through kpop methodology re: Sophia in the video. The actual marketable novelty came from the fact that they were a global girl group, not by rejecting the kpop influence - that influence is the other half of what made it all unique in the first place.
The whole deal with Katseye and their relationship with kpop is incredibly nuanced and layered with a lot of different structural aspects of business, culture, and media. They arenât and were never going to be just one or the other. I donât think their marketing ever tried to present them that way, either. Unfortunately, nuance is THE WORST fucking thing in the world for the internet, so this whole deal was often portrayed haphazardly or was received through a very limited, generalizing and divisive lens. I think any attempts Katseye made to distance themselves from being SOLELY kpop or SOLELY global led a lot of people to internalize it as if they were completely rejecting whatever side was in question, which might be where your impression is coming from
Right? I stopped watching when they said "we wanna take the k out of kpop" in the first seconds of the show but suddenly they want a piece of the cake?
It's obvious. They want certain shield which k-pop give. You see people are more critical actually about their own culture than others. If they called themselves "American" group that would put them in pretty hard category especially in the matter of vocals. Katseye is not bad vocally for k-pop but they are on lower side in case of American market. K-pop is safe space for them. I once see discussion about heavily autotuned performance of Huntrix live on YouTube and people seriously tried to convince others that's k-pop genre things and that they simply use autotune for artistic purpose lol. Girls could easily call themselves American group looking at their background but it's simply unlucrative to do.
Hold on, I think youâre being a little reductive here. First of all, youâre using the âAmericanâ label, but thatâs not how theyâre promoting themselves at all - thereâs still a distinction between âglobalâ and âAmericanâ, and if you donât like âglobalâ then at the very least that sphere of the market theyâre trying to corner is âwesternâ, which includes America - and what youâre saying is fair enough on some level since theyâre based in LA and do business within the American music market, but itâs still inaccurate.
Remember that half of the members are from outside of America, two of those not from western countries at all (Yoonchae is literally Korean, an ex kpop trainee FROM Korea), and the other three are from non-American immigrant families, two of those being non-western/mixed as well. Those three ARE American, for sure, but the branding spotlight of their ethnicities is not JUST a marketing ploy and I think thatâs made very clear when each of them speak on how much they want to promote their heritages through this project and try to be symbols of representation. Itâs rather narrow-minded of you to imply that theyâre only doing that for monetary purposes, but I can acknowledge that the way it was presented in dream academy certainly felt like that at times. That was a while ago, though, and well outside of their control.
I think your comment on people being âmore critical of their own culturesâ is very generalized and not really based in anything besides your subjective or potentially anecdotal opinion. Marketing does not just operate off of broad and unsubstantiated statements like that (put a pin in that). Again, thereâs an element of truth to it for sure, but the novelty of Katseye comes from the BLENDING of kpop methodology with western music and promotion. The group exists to corner a market that DOESNâT exist - high-calibre, expansive performers in a girl group with diverse, global appeal. This is not a secret, and this is certainly not exclusively âAmericanâ.
Lastly, youâre literally just wrong about the vocal appeal of Katseye. Theyâre not the BEST performers out there, and Iâm not gonna act like they are, but the whole drama academy selection process existed to find incredibly high-level performers in all realms (dance, voice, presence, visuals). (Okay, take the pin out now) a company like HYBE would NEVER create and promote a group concept solely to cater to the criticisms, or lack thereof, of a certain market. Kpop companies use scandal FOR marketing, and the girls were selected BECAUSE they have talent that largely withstands criticism. The only exception to this is manon, because she wasnât a performer, and yeah the less talented visual member is crutch taken from k-pop itself, so you can take that. But Katseye exists to BRING high level performance (specifically in dance) and detailed, manufactured social media content/fan engagement TO western markets. The reason katseyes live vocals arenât as (potentially) consistent as a modern, solo western vocal act is because they are also dancing to difficult and taxing choreography and expected to give unyielding stage presence 100% of the time. The western market has never HAD a girl group like this before, so of course HYBE is going to capitalize off of this lack of presence while also using the kpop methodology to promote the group globally, like in eastern markets that ARE used to this kind of performance. Western and eastern performers lip sync and autotune all the time, itâs not limited to one market or another. Katseye already blows western groups like fifth harmony (their most recent contemporary) out of the water in terms of their vocal and dance ability, and theyâve only been going for less than two years.
I donât know if you read the other comment I left in this thread, but this is exactly the type of thing I was talking about. Katseye exists in an extremely unique and complicated intersection of business, culture, and media - large, complex systems with globe-spanning intricacies and complications. The line of thinking youâre mentioning is totally flatlined and unrealistic, and is exactly why half of the discourse around Katseye (like whether theyâre kpop or not) is so useless and never-ending. This isnât the social media controversy created intentionally by HYBE (like in dream academy), this is the wildly complex merging of decades-long structural forces that people continue to argue about without even bothering to start thinking about how far it extends outside of their own realm of understanding.
Remember that half of the members are from outside of America
The same you can tell about many k-pop groups. They are still marketed as Korean though. So it's marketing decision how it's called. And all Americans are defacto immigrants (unless someone is pure native American if that possible) . whatever they like this fact or not that's fact.
And remember if you put yourself in category "american" and become extremely popular group act you automatically become compared to legendary acts. I don't think in Katseye is even someone vocally on the level of Beyonce, not mentioned much more talented vocalists who were in the american well known groups. They are probably better than Pussycat dolls though lol. So it would be definitely bad decision marketing wise especially that market already create their own groups probably more vocally focused.
I feel like youâve misunderstood me, or else youâre contradicting yourself, Iâm trying to say that Katseye is NOT âAmericanâ, despite having American members, theyâre âglobalâ. And if youâre going to HAVE to say âAmericanâ, you should say âwesternâ because thatâs way more accurate, but even then the whole point of the group is that theyâre not just âwesternâ or âkpopâ, theyâre âglobalâ. Itâs just semantics, normally it doesnât matter too much but to me it weakens what youâre specifically trying to convey. Especially with you doubling down on kpop groups having non-Korean members but itâs still kpop, like the point Iâm making here is that Katseyeâs branding is GLOBAL so it doesnât matter where specifically the members are from as much as the fact that theyâre all from different places, and itâs marketed to all of the different places theyâre from and more.
But no, I never tried to say theyâre Beyonce level performers, and obviously some of the Katseye members are better at things like vocals or dance than others, thatâs part of the utility of having a girl group with multiple members. Theyâre certainly not BAD though, theyâre not even low-tier when it comes to the western market and I feel like thatâs pretty obvious. So yeah some older western groups may have had stronger vocalists than Katseye, but probably not every member of each group, and certain Katseye members are easily high-tier performers/vocalists (Sophia, Lara, Megan) compared to other western acts if any of them were to go solo. But some of them, not so much! Western music standards donât fully encompass everything that Katseye actually DOES (which is not JUST limited to their live performances, either) which is why the Kpop-adjacent distinction is so important and the most accurate in terms of simplicity of a label.
What I generally mean that's marketing is not about being truthful. It's about how you want to be seemed. Show business is built on white lies, no one care there so much about facts, what they care it's image. And chosing right image make you ahead of the game. It's important because it's never fair business. Just look even just in k-pop from other perspective, there are some groups which are really ahead of the game vocally. But you have to well understand market to know that because of how lypsyncing and high backtrack is popular in the industry, this cause that at first hearing everyone seems to be on similar level what it's exactly white lies lol. That's why big companies don't want to be part of the show like Queendom or Kingdom because direct comparison destroy illusion.
Ah if that is the case why do people give XG a hard time? They are X-Pop if you want to get technical but still promote in Korea as well.
They have been promoting in Japan a bit more recently. Along with having just appeared on the season finale of The Voice.
I don't see what difference it makes as just seems like gatekeeping to me. Katseye should be able to do the same. I'm sure they will get some shade for this but why? :/
Katseye is based in LA and sing in English. It's pop. I think people are quick to forget that the K-pop training system was based on the Backstreet Boys and N'sync boyband boot camp from the 90's. Korea just took the concept and became masters of perfecting and capitalizing it.
They're under Geffen Records and most music critics and experts who have studied music culture would disagree. Even the composition of most of Katseye's songs follow a structure to appeal to an American audience. Just because a member expresses their opinion doesn't mean it's true.
They're under Hybe too and most music critics and experts who have studied music culture would agree they are Kpop. That's why music charts and articles say they are. The composition of Katseye songs follow the exact Kpop structure. Where is the America part? Also now you're saying they're American not even Global?? Even Sofia never said American-Pop. She said Kpop and Global.
It's better for them to just say that they were inspired by K-Pop.
This whole "we are both" is some pretentious crap.
Seems they want to ride the K-Pop wave while also distancing themselves from it? As if the K-Pop label is a burden to them? Maybe that's not their intention but that's what it looks like to me and plenty others.
I mean can you give some examples? They answer the questions they are given, Iâve never seen them dodge or shy away from a kpop question, theyâve always openly stated that theyâre a global girl group which is a fusion.
this debate has always been dumb.....global pop is still a new thing/genre, so of course it's not gonna have a correct label as of rn. Currently (as far as I'm aware) the only groups considered global pop are KATSEYE & GIRLSET/vcha?? That's TWO groups as of 2025, so yeah ofc they're not gonna have a proper category. Also like 80% of KATSEYE fans are also K-POP stans so....
Global pop (global groups) has always existed in pop tho!
Destinys child is a global group as Backstreet Boys, ABBA, *NSYNC, TLC and one direction, Blackpink, BTS, Little mix (modern global groups)⌠just to name a fewâŚ.
Global groups have existed before it suddenly was shifted in meaning in 2024 making some people believe that âitâs a new thing' but itâs not.
The Kpop company doesn't make them Kpop
Did you not see Making the Band?
Dancing is what makes songs Kpop now?
Kpop isn't the first or only music genre to include photocards
The songs they promote on Korean songs are fully in English, like when international artists perform on there.
The Kpop company doesn't make them Kpop
Did you not see Making the Band?
Dancing is what makes songs Kpop now?
Kpop isn't the first or only music genre to include photocards
The songs they promote on Korean songs are fully in English, like when international artists perform on there.
They're definitely not kpop
did you even watch the video. Sophia says they're both.
bruh they're whole foundation is kpop. Literally competition show to create a music group. Founding company is hybe (currently the biggest kpop company). Literally they do dance challenges with every hybe kpop group. Their friends with the other hybe girl groups they have a literal group chat with illit and leserrafim.They use weverse for fan interactions. they do lives with other kpop idols like Yunjin of le serrafim. they use every kpop formula. is leseraafim and bts not a kpop group cuz they have pure english songs??? like be for real they're core is kpop. it's fine you can be both look at blackpink and their members their both now as well but the core is still rooted in the kpop business model and strategy.
⢠signed to an american label
⢠based in la, not korea
⢠sings entirely in english for western audiences
⢠having one korean member doesnt make it kpop
⢠non of them besides yoonchae went through the trainee system
⢠non are held to any idol standards
having photocards doesnt make you kpop.
using kpops business strategies bc its profitable doesnt make you kpop
yall need to stop calling these girls a kpop group
Hybe geffen is american- korean darling, not just American. And I love how you just threw away the rest. And I mean, you ain't anybody to tell them what they are when them themselves says they are partly kpop. Anyway this debate is stupid.
Thank you!! Yes I agree! It's a genre and formula. Xg might be a Japanese group that sings in English but its clear they belong in the kpop environment. Why? Because the fans want them to! They're only talked about in kpop settings because the fans noted "hey I like this and its so kpop-y".
"Katseye/girlset/XG arent kpop!" WHO CARES! They have the same vibes, their groups are designed to meet kpop standards, their visuals and themes/concepts are kpop-like. They interact with their fans like kpop idols do. They sell merch like kpop groups do (photo-cards, fun albums, Seasons Greetings ect.) So if fans want to talk about them in kpop environments who cares?
In their tapes they rapped in Korean, English, and Japanese, not that I think it matters, they are kpop in everything they do, promotions, fashion, sonically, language has little to do with it
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u/Same-World-209 Dec 17 '25
Bi-Pop