r/conlangs Lumoj 19h ago

Phonology Transliterating the Schwa Phoneme

In my language the schwa phoneme is a separate sound (and letter in the neograph), but I really struggle with how to transliterate it in a way that is easy to read.

My other vowels:
/i/ - transliterated as "i"

/u/ - transliterated as "u"

/o/ - transliterated as "ò"

/eɪ/ - transliterated as "è"

/ɔ/ - transliterated as o, unless it precedes an r, then it's "ar"

Here are my unsatisfactory transliteration rules for /ə/:

- if the syllable does not have a coda consonant, then it's "a"

- if the vowel precedes an r, then it's "er"

- otherwise it's "uh", but I don't like this

So, if you use the schwa as a dedicated (?), intentional phoneme, not simply an unstressed vowel, how do you transliterate in your language?

(I understand that many unstressed vowels will shift to a schwa sound over time.)

Upvotes

24 comments sorted by

u/Jonlang_ /kʷ/ > /p/ 19h ago

Welsh uses <y> to write its phonemic schwa.

u/Sofia_trans_girl 17h ago

In your case, since you have <o>, <ò> and <è> but no <e>, that would seem the most elegant choice.

u/MikeMilburysShoe 19h ago

In the natlangs I know of it’s usually just <e>.

u/AnaverageItalian 19h ago

in albanian it's ë

u/eyewave Mukkohatto 19h ago

ă supremacy (shamelessly stolen from romanian)

u/Live_Put1219 Aengt + Byccian + Teleng 19h ago

french uses e, english uses like everything, mandarin uses e for /ɵ/, close enough to schwa, indonesian uses e, russian uses y (ы) for /ɨ/ which is close enough

u/sparktrfy [iɛ] > [ɘ], [uɔ] > [ɵ] 19h ago

i don't have any languages with phonemic schwa, so no grapheme. the closest would be /ɘ/ in bặlfó which i transliterate <ă> (with additional tone marker).

u/SavingsOdd2766 The Worst Conlangs Ever! 19h ago

You can use y, ä, ë, ə, e sometimes, etc..

NOTE: Əə ≠ /ə/

u/thatguythoma 19h ago

‘ë’ works really well, so do ‘ǝ’ and ‘ė’.

u/Pezychips 19h ago

My two languages with phonemic schwa use ă and e respectively

u/horsethorn 19h ago

Iraliran doesn't have a q (always kw), so I use that when I'm writing a schwa.

u/Thalarides Elranonian &c. (ru,en,la,eo)[fr,de,no,sco,grc,tlh] 19h ago

In my old sketch of Azevzhì, a language distantly related to Elranonian, /ə/ is represented by 〈ë〉 when stressed and 〈ÿ〉 when unstressed. The different letters reflect the phonetics. Stressed /ə/ is lowered and fronted towards [a~æ], while unstressed /ə/ is raised to [ɘ] and for some speakers also fronted to [ɪ], merging with unstressed /i/ (represented by 〈y〉).

stem nom.sg. {-∅} nom.pl. {-r}
(1) {dʒ-ˊ} ‘man’ dëzh /də́ʒ/ dzhër /dʒə́r/
(2) {ɑlh-ˊ} ‘god’ alëh /ɑlə́h/ alʼhër /ɑlhə́r/
(3) {θiw-ˊ} ‘horse‘ thyw /θíw/ thywër /θiwə́r/
(4) {ɔ́kθ-} ‘knowledge, experience’ okÿth /ɔ́kəθ/ okthÿr /ɔ́kθər/
(5) {θíw-} ‘language’ thŷw /θíw/ thywÿr /θíwər/

In (1–3) stress is tied to the last syllable, in (4–5) to the stem vowel. Schwa emerges to break up final clusters. ‘Horse’ & ‘language’ are homophonous in nom.sg., the circumflex accent in thŷw serves only to disambiguate the two words.

u/AnlashokNa65 19h ago

My only language with phonemic /ə/ uses <a> since /ə/ is the closest to an a-like vowel in the inventory (the other vowels are /u i/). There is a fourth vowel <ä> that is /a~æ~ə/ depending on the dialect.

u/Atom_Tester carrenà, gotlöbitu, legaziōnese 19h ago

Ageutan either uses unstressed a or e or the letter è like in la sistèma, mè, tè, sè, tchè, and chè

u/Awkward-Stam_Rin54 18h ago

I use ù. Not much reason other than the fact it's on my french laptop keyboard, all the other diacritic vowels on the keyboard have already been used up (except à).

u/Jesanime Mbox Ail 18h ago

Mbox Ail uses ę

u/creepmachine Kaesci̇̇m, Ƿêltjan, Kýrrits 17h ago

Kýrrits uses <i> for /ə/, which doesn't really help you since <i> is spoken for. If it had phonemic /i/ I might be tempted to use <ı> for /ə/. Don't know why, it just makes sense to me.

u/Blue22111 16h ago

I’m always fond of using <ă> (as Romanian marks schwa) or <ë> (as Albanian marks schwa) personally, if it’s a sound that can be anywhere. I generally use <ă> more often though.

Obviously that depends on what aesthetic you want though. What does your language look like when written out? That may help us recommend a representation that better fits the overall look of your language better than solely showing how you transcribe your other vowels.

Purely based on what you’ve already detailed, you seemingly don’t have /a/ or anything else similar, so I’d say to just use <a> to represent /ə/ and just have /ɔr/ written as <or> instead of <ar>

One comment on the other vowels as well. I’d suggest just having <e> = /eɪ/ instead of using a diacritic for it, then either have <e> with some diacritic represent /ə/ instead of the other way around like you have it or just go for the <a> = /ə/ suggestion from before and never have <e> be /ə/

u/Maleficent-Pie8040 Kama̋lnarā, Qumurišīt... (2nd account) 16h ago

⟨ë⟩ or just ⟨ə⟩

u/StarfighterCHAD Fyuc [fjut͡ʃ], Çelebvjud [d͡zələˈb͡vjud], Peizjáqua [peːˈʒɑkʷə] 15h ago

It seems like <e> could handle /ə/ as you list <è> as the only e. Both /ə/ and /eɪ/ could be either <e> or <è> depending on your preference.

u/al_x22 15h ago

Just write V for all vowels and let the reader imphere which vowel that is from context

u/SuitableDragonfly 13h ago

I just transliterate it as <a> in all contexts, with /a/ being <ä>.

In Hebrew, schwa is usually either <e> or <'>, you could do one of those. 

u/Curious-Painter-194 13h ago

I haven't seen anyone mention Cherokee's use of <v> It's one of my favorites fs

Although, in my conlangs I tend to go with various diacritics over <a, e, o>. Usually, it's <é> because it looks like the ipa symbol and it's the first symbol I ever used so it stuck. But closest sound-wise for me is my pronunciation of /a/ which begats <á> or <à> depending on how lazy of a typer I wanna be. (my keyboard defaults to à, and i have to swipe over to write á)

If accented vowels are already plentiful, I might go for the diagraph <eo> or the <œ> symbol.

u/suxtula Miadiut 1h ago

I use the good old double dotted ï